DPPt/HGSS Silvermagpie's Team (Sceptile)

[Magpie]

Since I got some good advice with Flygon, I thought I might as well have somewhere I can ask other questions about the other members of my team. I'm looking to get into competitive battling (4th Gen).

So, I'm going to ask about Floatzel , who I know is not the best water pokemon anyway, but I love him. Only he and Honchkrow survived the opening of Pal Park, when the rest of my Diamond in game team were forgotten...

Anyway, this is Floatzel as he stands:

Floatzel
Serious Nature
Strong Willed
Swift Swim

Moves:
Surf STAB
Ice Beam
Water Pulse STAB (For double battles - can't have surf as my only water move)
Dig

I want him to be the best he can be, so can anyone offer me some advice? Like I said above, Water Pulse is for double battles. I like those best, so surf is a dangerous move to my other pokemon (esp Charizard)

 

[KoL]

Floatzel is a Physical Sweeper, so you don't want Surf, Ice Beam or Water Pulse on him really. Also, two turn moves such as Dig are a big no-no, since the opponent can counter you with a Flying-type (Zapdos comes to mind). Here's my recommendation for a Floatzel moveset:

Floatzel @ Life Orb
Adamant
Swift Swim

- Waterfall
- Ice Fang
- Brick Break
- Crunch

Waterfall is the best Physical-type Water move in the game in my opinion, and will do a lot more damage than either Surf or Water Pulse on Floatzel. Ice Fang is effectively a physical version of Ice Beam, which again will do a lot more damage off Floatzel's superior Attack stat. Brick Break will deal with any strong Normal-type or Dark-type foes, and Crunch will put away any Ghosts/Psychics who try to take you on.

 

[Magpie]

I never even considered that Floatzel was a physical sweeper. I forgot about the two-turn attack rule too... I'm so glad I asked. Waterfall and Ice fang sure make sense. I used by brick break TM ages ago. Will have to see about getting another, because that makes sense also. Crunch would be a good move too, although Honchkrow and Sceptile have dark moves pretty much covered (Nightslash).

Thanks for the input. I'll definitely go use some heartscales on Floatzel. Thanks again

 

[Plapti]

Heh...with some minor investments into the Special Attack Stat, Ice beam is perfectly viable.

Floatzel@Expert Belt/Life Orb/Muscle Band
Lonely Nature
-Waterfall
-Ice Beam
-Brick Break
-Pursuit/Quick Attack/Crunch

With a minor investment of 80 S.Atk EVs, Ice Beam will work fine.
EV set: 252 Spd/ 80 S.Atk/ 176 Atk

Same gist as KoL, so no explanation needed. Other than Quick attack is added for a First-turn attack.

 

[Magpie]

I'd be happy to keep Ice Beam. Floatzel is pretty good with it

Thanks a lot, I'll go look at the Charms'Dex and find who I need to battle for those EVs

[glow=red,2,300]Modified Post starts here[/glow]

Thanks for the help everyone Now I'd like help on two other members of my team - Manectric and Honchkrow.

Manectric
Bold Nature
Likes to trash about
Lightningrod ability

Thunderbolt STAB
Flamethrower
Discharge STAB
Hidden Power (Water) (I think)

I know, shame on me for having two electric moves. I couldn't think of anything else to give him. I'd like to replace it with something else, but what? Any other input would be great.

Honchkrow
Adamant Nature
Quick to flee
Super Luck ability

Wing attack
Psychic
Night Slash
?? (was my fly slave, but two move attacks are no good )

Honchkrow's moveset is pretty bad I think. He's great with Night Slash though

Any help on either of these two would be very much appreciated

 

[KoL]

For Manectric:

Manectric @ Life Orb/Choice Specs
Modest
Lightningrod

- Thunderbolt
- Flamethrower
- Charge Beam/Thunder Wave
- Hidden Power (Water)

I'd say go for Charge Beam since you may get lucky and hax a Sp.Atk increase from it. Besides, it's either Charge Beam, or Hyper Beam...no guesses which beam is better, despite having two moves of the same type. Thunder Wave is also viable to paralyze someone on the switch if you want.

I would say Honchkrow can go one of two ways, but the Adamant nature kinda spoils it. Well, lets have a go...

Honchkrow @ Scope Lens/Life Orb
Adamant
Super Luck

- Night Slash
- Steel Wing
- Aerial Ace
- Thunder Wave/Return/Roost

You'd generally want to use Night Slash the most here, since combined with Super Luck, Scope Lens and it's own increased crit chance you should be getting a lot of crits with it. Steel Wing and Aerial Ace are there for a bit of extra type coverage, and the final move is up in the air - Thunder Wave if you want some paralysis, Return for another attacking move, and Roost if you want a heal move.

Although this set wouldn't suit your Honchkrow's nature, it's still...kinda viable. See what you think:

Honchkrow @ Salac Berry
Modest (this is the best nature for this)
Super Luck

- Dark Pulse
- Hidden Power (Fighting/Fire/Ground)/Shadow Ball/Thunder Wave/Roost
- Psychic
- Nasty Plot

Air Slash would have been nice, but oh well. Here's one to buck the trend of all the Physical Attacking Honchkrows out there: Honchkrow's Sp.Atk is Base 105 - although it's not as high as his Physical Attack (Base 125), it is still pretty good in my opinion. Boost it up even further with Nasty Plot, hope Salac activates when Honchkrow's not able to take any more hits, and start killing stuff. Dark Pulse for STAB, Psychic for Fighting-types, Hidden Power will stop Steel-types from walling you, Shadow Ball just because you can, or you can use Thunder Wave or Roost instead. Although Umbreon and most Steel-types will be able to wall this without Hidden Power, it could catch someone off-guard who expects your Honchkrow to be a Physical Sweeper, which most probably would.

 

[Magpie]

Is Hidden Power (Water) the best for Manectric, or would Ice be better? I tried Hyper beam on him a while ago. It wasn't good XD

Charge beam sounds good, I didn't consider it before, mainly because I normally just default to Thunderbolt. Overall I'm happy with Manectric, so the minor changes are worth doing.

Honchkrow is a hard one. Thing is a really like the one I've got, her attack stat is great. The modest nature Honchkrow seems great, and it certainly would be a surprise, but I'd rather keep the one I've got.

For my adamant 'Krow I'd consider roost, mainly because her defense is terrible. Steel wing is interesting. Meh, Honchkrow hurts my head. Would it be best to just breed another, if adamant isn't a good nature?

 

[KoL]

Ice is better on Manectric since the only Pokemon that would be able to resist all your moves would be Lanturn. However, I'd say Water is fine since you can hurt any Ground/Rock types that try to stop you.

Honchkrow's Adamant nature is perfect for a physical attacker. I'd keep it as it is.

 

[Magpie]

Charizard
Quiet Nature
Good Endurance
Blaze Ability

Flamethrower STAB
Dragon Pulse
Air Slash STAB
??

As far as I know those moves make sense. He did have Flare Blitz, but A. It made two fire attacks on Charizard and B. It was a physical attack and therefore no good. So, any ideas?


Sceptile
Naive Nature
Mischievous
Overgrow Ability

Leaf Blade STAB
Giga Drain STAB
X-Scissor
Night Slash

Bad. I kinda got stuck on moves. Would Energy Ball be better than Leaf Blade due to it being a Sp. Attack? Any help here would be great.

 

[Gorgonopsid Master]

Charizard is decent and I think for a last move if possible HP (Electric) but heres another set that can emphasize him as a special sweeper.

Sunny Day
Solar Beam
Flamethrower
Focus Blast/Ancient power/Air Slash

Sunny Day to boost Flamethrower and Solar Beam
Solar Beam should only be used when sunny day is in place and helps get rid of annoying Water Types
Flamethrower can be awsome when Sunny Day is in place makes its power 142.5 but STAB makes it even more powerful
One of the last three for coverage.

Hope this helps ill try and get one for sceptile later

 

[Magpie]

I'd completely forgotten that Sunny Day makes Solar Beam happen in one turn I'd considered have Solar Beam on Charizard a while ago, but when I found that Power Herb was only good for one use I kind of forgot about it... Could be interesting to consider it again.

Out of the last three I'd probably keep Air Slash, just for STAB

Thanks for your help! You reminded me about stuff I'd forgotten

[glow=red,2,300]Modified Post here[/glow]

I realised that my past moveset for Sceptile was Physical attack based, which is bad.
Sceptile is now looking like this;

Naive Nature + Mischievous (Good boost to speed and Special Attack)

Energy Ball STAB
Giga Drain STAB
Focus Blast
Hidden Power (Ice)

I'm quite happy with these moves, although I was hoping for Hidden Power Rock, to cover more of Sceptile's weaknesses than Ice does. However Ice covers fellow grass and flying types, plus some bugs with half flying.
I know I have two grass moves, but this is all I can come up with. Any suggestions?

 

[Pheonix]

Only two move that I saw that might fit in were Dragon Pulse or Toxic. Might even consider Double Team, but I don't know how much that move is frowned upon. Dragon Pulse allows for at least neutral damage to just about everything, but does give overlap with your HP Ice, so it is a toss up there. I just couldn't believe the amount of physical moves in a pokemon that has a higher Sp Atk. Kind of a crappy move pool when you think of it in that perspective.

 

[Magpie]

That was my original problem. Since she had so many physical moves in her movepool I seemed to have assumed that she had good attack. Nope. Sceptile does have a pretty bad selection of special moves. I'd have probably gone for Dragon Pulse over HP Ice, but I don't have the TM, plus HP Ice is a pretty good Hidden Power when you look at some of Sceptile's weaknesses. Toxic was also an option, I'd have preferred Sludge Bomb, but alas, she can't learn it

 

[Ruko]

I'm so tired of people thinking Dragon and Ice are so closely related >

Dragon is only super-effective against Dragon, yes, but is neutrally effective against all other types except steel. meaning as a whole, it is almost[keyword here] as useful as combining Thunderbolt and Ice beam.
Dragon combined with Ice offers no problems and still offers more super-effective coverage than Dragon alone.

with that aside...

EnergyBall/Giga Dran
Dragon Pulse
HP Ice
Focus Blast/Earthquake

Focus Blast seems to have a lot of fans around here, even though I don't like it for its inaccuracy...
It covers Steel types that Dragon Pulse can't as well as being a special attack. Just watch the accuracy.
Earthquake is a Physical move, sure, but the lowest the attack of a level 50 Sceptile can be is 90 with that nature. So it can still hit for a decent amount of damage at the least and makes for a nice wild card should the opponent send out a Special Wall.

if the base power of your Hidden Power seems weak, consider giving it up for room to have both Earthquake and Focus Blast... X scissor might offer a bit more coverage too, but I wouldn't want to put more than one Physical move on a pokemon intended for Special attacks.


[I PMed you about your issues with Dragon Pulse]

 

[112% Elusive]

Well if you are going to use Focus blast, you may as well place a Scope Lens (Or whatever item increases Accuracy on there. I think its a Wide Lens, actually)

Well, If your Sceptile has sub-par def, and Sp. Defense I'd go with giga Drain to recover lost Hp, a few PP-ups wouldn't go amiss here, (If its allowed on 'Charms Standard play and that's what you were intending to use it for.) You could place a Big root on him/her for this, but then you're giving up extra accuracy.

 

[Magpie]

EnergyBall/Giga Dran
Dragon Pulse
HP Ice
Focus Blast/Earthquake

Focus Blast seems to have a lot of fans around here, even though I don't like it for its inaccuracy...

I've never used Focus Blast on a Pokemon before, but it does get suggested a lot on here, so I thought I'd give it a go. Earthquake would be a good choice, especially if you think it would still be effective. Sceptile's attack stat isn't so bad, it's just that her special attack is almost double it : I'll go see if I have an Earthquake TM too...

Well if you are going to use Focus blast, you may as well place a Scope Lens (Or whatever item increases Accuracy on there. I think its a Wide Lens, actually)

Well, If your Sceptile has sub-par def, and Sp. Defense I'd go with giga Drain to recover lost Hp, a few PP-ups wouldn't go amiss here, (If its allowed on 'Charms Standard play and that's what you were intending to use it for.) You could place a Big root on him/her for this, but then you're giving up extra accuracy.

Wide Lens would be a must. I don't like not having accuracy. Sceptile's defenses are ok, they aren't brilliant but she can survive a couple of hits. I may keep Giga Drain, but I'm currently thinking;

Energy Ball
HP Ice
Dragon Pulse
Earthquake

I think thats a pretty well-rounded moveset... Plus the accuracy is so much better!